The ProLife Team Podcast | Episode 40 with Maria Gallagher | Talking About Roe vs Wade Being Overturned in the Dobbs Case

The ProLife Team Podcast
The ProLife Team Podcast | Episode 40 with Maria Gallagher | Talking About Roe vs Wade Being Overturned in the Dobbs Case
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Listen to Maria Gallagher and Jacob Barr talk about Roe vs Wade being overturned in the Dobbs Case and how this impacts Pennsylvania & America.

Summary

This is Jacob Barr, and in this episode of the Pro-Life Team Podcast, I had an enlightening conversation with Maria Gallagher from the Pennsylvania Pro-life Federation. We discussed the significant impact of the Dobbs case and the potential overturn of Roe vs. Wade on Pennsylvania and the nation. Maria, as the Legislative Director of the Pennsylvania Pro-life Federation, shared insights on the organization’s focus areas, including abortion, infanticide, euthanasia, and embryonic stem cell research.

We delved into the ramifications of the Dobbs case, examining its challenge to Roe vs. Wade’s viability clause through the lens of a Mississippi 15-week abortion ban. Maria highlighted the importance of considering both the mother and unborn child in abortion debates, emphasizing the numerous amicus briefs filed in support of overturning Roe vs. Wade.

The conversation also covered the potential return of abortion legislation to state jurisdiction post-Roe vs. Wade, the role of pregnancy centers, and the need for a cultural shift towards life-affirming choices. We discussed the risks associated with the abortion pill, the pressures women face in making abortion decisions, and the support offered by pregnancy centers.

Maria and I explored the potential future of abortion legislation and its implications for women and unborn children, emphasizing the need for compassionate and comprehensive care. The podcast concluded with a prayer led by Maria, seeking guidance and support for the pro-life movement.

#Hashtags: #ProLifePodcast, #DobbsCase, #RoeVsWade, #PennsylvaniaProLife, #AbortionLegislation, #UnbornRights, #PregnancyCenters, #AbortionPillRisks, #ProLifeMovement, #CulturalShift.

Transcript

The transcript was automatically generated and may contain errors.

Jacob Barr :

Welcome to the pro-life Team Podcast i’m Jacob Barr, and I’m here with Maria and we’re going to talk about Roe versus Wade being overturned in the Dobbs case, along with how that has impacted Pennsylvania, how that’s impacted our nation and how that may impact pregnancy clinics and the work that’s being done on the ground. So Maria, I am really glad that you’re here and I’m glad I was headed to talk to you. Would you introduce yourself as if you were talking to a room of pro-life friends of people in your community who are looking or passionate about helping the unborn and moms and young couples?

Maria Gallagher :

Hello everybody i’m Maria Gallagher, and I’m the Legislative Director for the Pennsylvania Pro-life Federation, an affiliate of National Right to Life. We deal with the issues of abortion, infanticide, euthanasia, and embryonic stem cell research, and we deal with legislation and education and political action. And we’re working to restore legal protection for preborn children and help for their mothers.

Jacob Barr :

Awesome and so where would you like to start today would you like to start by talking about the road draft would you like to start talking about maybe the different laws in California? What would you put as your current priority of what you think might be interesting to start with?

Maria Gallagher :

I think that we should start talking about the draft of the Dobbs US Supreme Court decision because that has leaked out and it’s caused a major media firestorm, I think across the country, and I think it’s important for people to know exactly what that’s all about.

Jacob Barr :

I agree so what? So what are your impressions of the Dobb case or what part would you like to start with in that arena or in that space?

Maria Gallagher :

Certainly the Dobbs case is so very important because it tests the viability clause of Roe versus Wade so this is based on a Mississippi 15 week abortion ban which is a pre viability ban and the court is being asked to uphold this ban. But the court is also being asked to do something even more important than that, which is to overturn Roe versus Wade, which is the 1973 US Supreme Court decision which basically brought us abortion on demand for any reason or for no reason at all during all nine months of pregnancy. And the Pennsylvania pro-life Federation was very fortunate to file an amicus brief in the case or friend of the court brief. And in this brief, we argued that when there is an abortion, there are always two people involved, the mother and the unborn child. And really and truly, both of those people deserve medical care and should be protected under the law. And so various organizations, pro-life organizations, different groups have filed amicus briefs in the court arguing various different things in order to convince the court to overturn Roe versus Wade. Everything from the fact that Roe versus Wade does not advance the cause of women to the fact that Roe versus Wade is not necessary for Women’s Health and safety. So there are various arguments that have been put out there. And the leaked draft indicated that Justice Alito believed that Roe versus Wade should in fact be overturned and that there may in fact be a majority of US Supreme Court justices who believe that’s very same thing. And it’s really important to recognize the fact that once Roe versus Wade is overturned, the likely scenario is that the whole issue of abortion returns to the individual states so that the people, through their duly elected representatives, can decide abortion policy. That would be the fair thing to do. Because way back in 1973 what the US Supreme Court did was it knocked out all the abortion laws in all 50 states, was never put up for a vote, and even pro abortion justices such as Ruth Bader Ginsburg believed that Roe versus Wade was unjustly decided. So it’s high time that Roe versus Wade be thrown into the dustbin of history.

Jacob Barr :

So you’re is you said that you’re the right to life group what what’s? What’s the name of the right to life group that you’re with?

Maria Gallagher :

I’m with the Pennsylvania Pro-life Federation, which is the Pennsylvania affiliate of National Right to Life.

Jacob Barr :

Ok and your group provided you called it what what? What was the document that you provided that was it cited in the?

Maria Gallagher :

It was, it was called the an amicus brief or friend of the court brief and I am not certain that it was cited in the leaked draft, but it was one of the documents that the US Supreme Court had to go through when making its decision so it could very well have played a part in that decision and we’re very pleased with that. You know, it’s like having your fingerprints on history.

Jacob Barr :

What in which Month did was that amicus brief provided to the Supreme Court? Was that like in January or was it last year?

Maria Gallagher :

It was. It was some months ago i think it might have even been last year so it goes back a ways, yes.

Jacob Barr :

So and I and I think yeah and so essentially it seems like everyone yeah it’s it seems like it’s logical that having the power or the decision return to legislation the body, you know, the body the log, the law creating body of state legislation or even Congress, you know having that return from the court so the courts you know overturning this decision of the courts creating law to the legislative bodies creating law seems like a universally good idea. But even more important than that, you know, promoting life protection, not that we would be supportive of a law created by the legislative bodies that would destroy life, but rather. Yeah but essentially it seems like. Yeah the fact that the Supreme Court created. Yeah this ruling 50 years ago, just, yeah, it just seems so. Yeah, There’s so many things that were only done here like, you know, like having it, having rights or like a law created at the Supreme Court seems rare i can’t think of another case then again, I’m not an expert in the Supreme Court law. And then, and here we are 50 years later, almost, it’s like 49 and a half years later, we’re so we’re in the fiftieth year and it’s looking like it’s going to be overturned meanwhile, the justices are being threatened their houses and families are probably receiving huge assaults. And it’s a dangerous space for them, a dangerous time for them and public opinion is not supposed to impact a judge who is supposed to look at the law. But how can a judge not take into effect that their family is being threatened or their life is being threatened like that? What is what is the? What does that look like for how that might impact this case and or how it might impact what needs to be done in this scenario?

Maria Gallagher :

It is very troubling that the opinion was leaked, the draft opinion was leaked because that does set up a scenario where people could try to intimidate the justices and could try to sway the ultimate ruling. And that’s very unfortunate because the US Supreme Court should be sacrosanct and it should not be subjected to the whims of public opinion. And so I think that the justices are going to stand firm in this particular case i am very hopeful that they will, because we can’t have a situation where people can bully the Supreme Court into making a decision that they want. It has to be based upon the Constitution and the rule of law. And I think that i’m very grateful for the security that the Supreme Court has now to keep them safe because this is a very critical time in our nation’s history. And I think that it’s important to note that the US Supreme Court really went outside the bounds of the Constitution when they issued the 1973 US Supreme Court ruling Roe versus Wade. It was as if they invented this so-called right to abortion or right to privacy out of whole cloth. When it’s nowhere in the Constitution you cannot find the word abortion in the US Constitution it simply doesn’t exist. And so it was never just, it was never right. And it should be up to the individual states to decide abortion policy and our work is cut out for us in the individual states i mean, we have to work very hard to ensure that there are pro-life policies in place in different states around the country. And we know that some states have gone to the other extreme in passing very pro abortion legislation. And we’re hopeful that in Pennsylvania we’ll be able to pass good, solid pro-life legislation which will protect both babies and their mothers from harm.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah and it seems like a more closer to home discussion or battle when it’s taken from the federal level to the local state level like it feels like it’s more practical to that body of people. And I know that there’s probably going to be the expectation that there’s probably going to be rioting in the streets when Roe versus Wade is overturned but if you think about it, the states that are pro abortion and they and they you know, with their laws, you know what what? You know the fact that they’ll be right in the streets doesn’t really align with the fact that you know for their state their the laws match their majority or their opinion. And then for the states that are having pro-life laws passed or anti abortion laws passed makes sense that you know so it feels like we should have less logically, we should have less rioting in the streets when Roe versus Wade gets overturned except for the fact that the opposition is maybe not logical and just simply trying to trying to trying to use bully tactics and mob like bully tactics to persuade others. But if it feels like the majority, yeah, I’m really hoping that, yeah, the states, some states will have abortion and some states won’t have abortion and hopefully that will. You know, what are your thoughts on the on the outcome of the day when Roe gets overturned and what that day might look like?

Maria Gallagher :

Well, the day that Roe versus Wade is overturned will be a real victory for our country. It will be a victory for the rule of law it will be a victory for the US Constitution. And it’s been many years since many of us have been working on this particular project trying to overturn Roe versus Wade so it’s an answer to a lot of work and an answer to a lot of prayer. And I think that it’s important to note that once Roe versus Wade is overturned, I believe no matter what state you live in, pregnancy help centers, pregnancy resource centers become all the more important because the work is so vitally necessary to ensure that women have all the help and resources they need to bring their babies into the world. And the pregnancy centers are really the first line of defense in this fight for life. And it’s really incumbent upon all of us to support our local pregnancy centers i know at my particular church, we are collecting money for new ultrasound machines for our local pregnancy centers because their ultrasound machines are now outdated and they need state of the art equipment to deal with all of the clients that they’re going to see in the coming year. So I think all of us need to support our pregnancy centers in any way that we can and all of us have different talents and abilities, different resources available to assist those pregnancy centers in this critical time.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah and recently I was trying to calculate how many prayers have probably been lifted up. And I think that there’s probably millions of people, oh, I know there’s probably millions of people that have been praying over the course of 50 years and so I would estimate that there could literally be trillions of prayers offered to God, not just billions but I think there’s probably, like we probably ventured into the trillion territory when it comes to like just like the number of cries to God to overturn, you know, essentially to stop abortion to overturn Roe, to help these babies who are being slaughtered before, you know, the most vulnerable out of our community, the ones literally without voice, the ones who are youngest, most vulnerable and then also turning a mom against her own offspring is just wicked and evil no matter how you look at it. And all of that just simply, I think that reflects the number of prayers that have been offered to God and I just feel like, what when I started praying for abortion to get overturned, I didn’t think I would see it in my lifetime, but yet i was dedicated to work towards that result, even though I didn’t have the expectation that I would see it i thought my children or grandchildren would get to see the day when Rover, when Roe versus Wade would be overturned and when I know there were still a long ways from abortion being unthinkable. But at the same time, I feel like, you know, it’s good to celebrate, celebrate a bat, a win and to celebrate God answering prayers and to answer just, yeah, a trillion prayers. And it’s also interesting that this is like the fiftieth year so, like you know, it feels like that’s if there was ever a tally that would be biblical, it’d be the year of Jubilee, like the year of reset. And to consider something of this magnitude being overturned and in the fiftieth year is it just feels like an answer it feels like an amazing, miraculous answer to prayer and also to and to have it be done well we have Biden and Harris in the White House. You know, that does not, that did not that. It just feels like God is doing it at, you know, at a time when you know of all people, Harris in the White House is and Roe versus Wade is being overturned while she is there it just is remarkable that you know how powerful God is. And so there’s a lot to be excited about but yet also I think for pre C clinics, it feels like the day-to-day of helping women who are facing unplanned pregnancies. I feel like the work today is the same as it was five years ago and probably going to be the same as it will be in five years because pre C clinics are sort of like the boots on the ground just helping women who are going through a variety of struggles, who need help in a listening ear and good direction and material assistance and to meet Jesus in that full experience of getting help. And so I think, yeah, crazy clinics hopefully, you know, I think they’re sort of like, I don’t think they’re they they’re being attacked more today than they were in previous years somewhat. But at the same time I think, I think what they’re doing to help women in their communities is sort of sort of this. Yeah, it’s steadfast but it does feel like the political and law giving world is there’s a lot of there’s a lot of change in that space And the and the conversation right now is been well everyone is you know there’s a lot of talk a lot of people considering abortion right now and that’s and I think it’s good for people who have good logical arguments life giving you know God honoring arguments to speak up and try and voice these good things the people who are willing to listen and consider. And so I think that’s something that makes it worthwhile to. Yeah to reach out to people who are who may not have been as connected or involved in previous years.

Maria Gallagher :

I think that this is a great teachable moment in our country. I think that we can start those conversations now about when life begins, when the humanity of the unborn child should be respected and cherished and protected under the law, the effects of abortion on women, because they’re very harmful effects that can take place i mean, there’s psychological damage that can take place. Women who have had abortions may be more likely to try to take their own lives they may be more likely to be hospitalized for psychiatric illness. They may be more likely to suffer from eating disorders. All of these things are terrible burdens that are placed upon women today as a result of legal abortion. I think that we need to start a dialogue about how we can best help women in difficult circumstances. And abortion does not solve problems such as poverty or problems such as a lack of educational advancement or problems on the job relationship problems. It doesn’t solve any of those things. It only creates more problems for the women and we need to do our best to reach out to women with compassion and support and love. And that’s really the genius of the pregnancy center movement in this country going back many decades. It was just a brilliant model, this idea of comprehensive counseling and material support for women facing challenging circumstances and non judgmental support. And assistance to these women, it’s just extraordinary and miracles happen every day at these pregnancy centers and it’s not just although it that’s quite a bit the miracle of the unborn child and the child being brought into the world, but also the miracles that happen within the lives of these women. I mean, they go on to earn their Geds or their college diplomas, to get gainful employment, to find shelter, to turn their lives around. I mean, there are so many miracles in the making at these pregnancy centers that unfortunately, I think a lot of us take for granted and we cannot now because this is such a critical time in our nation’s history, we really need to support those centers.

Jacob Barr :

So Speaking of the miracles that happen regularly at the Princey Clinics, I would like you to reflect on where you’ve seen God’s fingerprints in the space that your group works. Where have you seen God’s fingerprints or his miraculous, you know, divine influence? Can you tell a story or share something that comes to mind? One of the things I like to do in this podcast is to share stories of God’s fingerprints in the pro-life world. Because, you know, his fingerprints are found throughout many stories and I think it’s really important for us to amplify and to record the stories of where God is having an impact in our lives and to share his fingerprints or his involvement and then to share that with others i think that is it’s, I think it’s a good practice for us to try and do so. Can you think of some stories or one story at least?

Maria Gallagher :

Certainly at the Pennsylvania pro-life Federation, we have local chapters throughout the Commonwealth these are local county based chapters and they do a variety of educational outreach activities and I know in one case, the Pennsylvania Pro-life Federation itself actually went to the Creation Christian Music Festival that’s held nearby. And we have these soft touch fetal models that we place on our display table. And we had somebody who picked up that model and we didn’t think anything about it. And then a year later, someone returned and it was actually a young woman who had given birth as result of that soft touch fetal model. So she had a change of heart she had an abortion scheduled. She changed her mind and she chose life. And that’s just one example of the many. I think that it’s very ironic what happened in Pennsylvania, you know, about 10 years ago. Kermit Gosnell was brought to light his terrible crimes in his House of Horrors abortion facility in West Philadelphia, where he actually murdered newborn babies and caused the death of female patients. And out of that terrible situation, the state legislature decided to act. And it passed an abortion center regulation law, which ensured that abortion facilities had to meet basic health and safety standards and had to be examined, at least inspected, once a year. And as a result of that, more than a half dozen abortion facilities actually closed their doors because they either could not or would not meet basic health and safety standards. And once abortion facilities shut down, the number of abortions are likely to decrease. And I think that whole situation of the state legislature acting was truly miraculous and many lives have been saved and hearts have been changed as a result of that legislation. And i know for instance in the city of Harrisburg, the state Capitol, we saw where an abortion facility had more than 44 pages worth of health and safety violations once it was in, once it was inspected. And as a result of that, the abortion facility actually surrendered its license after decades and decades of performing abortions here in Harrisburg. And to see that abortion facility finally closed its doors, that was truly miraculous.

Jacob Barr :

Wow, that those are such a good story especially the story of the abortion clinic closing, that is sounds like a lot of answered prayer right there.

Maria Gallagher :

Yeah, because there were so many years where people went down to the abortion center to pray and decide what counsel. And I was among the people that prayed down there. And I just couldn’t imagine a day when that abortion facility would not be in operation because it had been there for many years and we didn’t know what was going on inside i mean, we knew that abortions were taking place, but we didn’t know the terrible conditions in that facility until the inspection started, because in Pennsylvania, at one point, hair and nail salons had greater scrutiny than abortion facilities. And in Kermit Gosnell’s case, his abortion facility was not inspected for 17 years. Now imagine going to a restaurant that had not been inspection inspected in 17 years you just wouldn’t do it yeah. So it was completely bizarre and it was the result of the pro abortion policies of the governor’s office in Pennsylvania. And they just steadfastly refused to do inspections at these facilities. So once we had a pro-life governor in place, things changed and we were able to pass that meaningful pro-life legislation to make those abortion facilities accountable. And when they were made accountable, a lot of them had to close down because they couldn’t meet those basic health and safety standards it was just appalling.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah, it seems like one of the. A good prayer to pray is for the lies and the false beliefs and the and the deception that surrounds abortion and abortion clinics to be exposed for what’s really there and for and for the truth, you know, to be seen, which usually results in, you know, what was discovered there, which is things needed to shut down and close because it’s. Yeah it’s it seems like there’s layers upon layers of lies and dangerous tactics being used surrounding the death of the unborn or the killing or stopping of the unborn. So what would what would you consider a positive story that pro-life people Tracy clinic teams could be encouraged by what’s going on with the with the in the law in the Dobbs case or in the in these you know in the in that sphere what would be an encouraging story to share.

Maria Gallagher :

Well, I think a very encouraging story to share is the fact that in Pennsylvania, for instance, once Roe versus Wade is overturned, then we can begin the work of protecting preborn children and their mothers from harm. And in our state, we have a case before the state Supreme Court that was brought by the abortion industry, which would be like the Roe versus Wade of Pennsylvania. The abortion industry is asking for the state Supreme Court to declare a so-called right to abortion and right to taxpayer funding of abortion under the Pennsylvania Constitution. So in Pennsylvania we’re sponsoring the Life Amendment. And the Life Amendment would ensure that there is no such right under the PA constitution. And it would ensure that and the state legislature would be able to enact pro-life policies rather than the courts so the constitutional amendment has to pass both the Pennsylvania House and Senate in two consecutive sessions and then be placed on the ballot for voters to decide. So this is a very exciting time in Pennsylvania because we may finally get a chance to vote on this concept of taxpayer funding of abortion, which in Pennsylvania law has always been illegal, but as a result of a Supreme Court case at the state level could in fact be declared legal. So we’re really banding together with other pro-life organizations around the state to pass that life amendment. And I think that if you’re looking for a David and Goliath fight and a miracle that could happen, that’s it.

Jacob Barr :

Awesome. What do you think about the when it comes to miscarriage or you know a natural miscarriage or an ectopic pregnancy and what that looks like under a when rogue gets overturned and in some states abortion. You know, elective abortion is illegal. But what happens when there’s a natural miscarriage taking place or an ectopic pregnancy where the life of the baby, you know, essentially has no chance of survival unless it was transplanted to a different space and the life of the mother is at grave risk? What is what it seems to be a lot of concerns over people having miscarriage or that Gray zone of like, was it a natural abortion or was there some kind of action taken by the mom that created that miscarriage? Or was it influence in some way? I feel like there’s a lot of concerns over miscarriages and like and then cleaning, you know, and then having an abortion like procedure to pull out the remains of the child. And so I think there’s a lot of legitimate concerns there what are your thoughts on how this, you know this miscarriage space will be addressed in this new era that we’re approaching?

Maria Gallagher :

I think in the post row era it’s important to note that the pro-life movement is for both the mother and the child and we believe that both the mother and the child deserve the best possible medical care. So we treat both the mother and the child. If, in treating the mother and trying to save the mother’s life, the child dies, that is not an intentional act of killing. That’s not what we’re talking about. We’re not talking about natural miscarriages. You can still get the treatment that you need for miscarriages. What we’re talking about is ending the wholesale killing of millions upon millions of preborn babies, when in fact we need to safeguard the lives of both the mothers and the children, and our laws would reflect that fact. And the pro-life movement stands for the lives of both the mothers and the children, and beliefs that our laws should reflect that fact.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah, and yeah, this seems to be a lot of I was talking to someone at my church last night and she was saying that someone that was related i think it was her. Well, someone related to her, I can’t remember who was saying that she had a miscarriage and her insurance denied it because it was connected to being an abortion. Like it was an abortion procedure to remove the remains and so it wasn’t covered under her insurance. And I told her well that just needs to be addressed because you know a natural miscarriage is not you know not part of what the, you know what we you know as a group, the pro-life group, we care about all lives and if one life can be saved out of the two, then that’s what we want to do or if all the lives can be saved, then that’s what we want to do we want to save the most lives that we can. And if the baby’s life, if it’s an atopic pregnancy, the baby’s life isn’t going to make it and the mom’s life needs to be we need to intervene in order to help the mom survive that you know, the baby creating a problem in that if a fallopian tube. So anyways all that to say is I feel like there’s yeah, maybe when what kind of topics come up i feel like those insurance companies need to revisit their policies to make sure that they’re reflecting helping all the patients involved or as many patients that are able to be helped. And there’s a there was a pro-life Doctor Who he said, you know, when it comes to abortion, most, you know, if someone has brain cancer and they’re pregnant, you know, sometime doctors will say she should have an abortion. But he what he, you know, essentially he was saying that there’s, you know, there’s no medical reason to have an abortion ever. You know that, you know, essentially you can, you can treat the, you know, the brain cancer and the woman can still be pregnant it’s not going to interfere or make her chances better or worse for that brain cancer treatment. You know, she might have to delay radiation by a few weeks so the pregnancy gets further along. But overall it’s essentially there’s essentially you treat the you treat the problem and the pregnancy is not part of the problem. And so I think a lot of times people sort of lump them all together as if they have you have to get an abortion to try and make it so there’s less involved or less complicated. But in reality that’s not a way of treating all the patients the best way to treat all the patients is to treat all the patients they try and have the best outcome for the whole group.

Maria Gallagher :

Yeah, what Roe versus Wade did was it pit the rights of the mother against the rights of the child. And that’s not what is just or right. We need to support both the mother and the child and both of their rights need to be protected and cherished. So we it’s not an either or it’s a both. And you know, we support the mother, we support the child, we give care to both the mother and the child. And it’s important that all of our institutions recognize that fact and yes, we may have to go through some transformations in our society because we’ve had abortion legalized for so many years, but that’s a healthy transformation. That’s a healthy society that we’re building toward. We’re renewing a culture of life and I think that’s very important.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah and i think part of getting to that culture of life is as the counter culture of death is outraged over life being protected in these situations. I think that’s it makes me think of, you know, the price of liberty is not free like there’s a cost in the, you know, so you know, for us to have freedoms here in the US, there was a lot of, you know, a lot of people gave their lives so that we could have freedom here in the US And I believe the freedom for the unborn and the liberty of the unborn, you know, that price that we’ll be that we’re paying is coming from the opposition’s attacks on us. And by going through those attacks, we’re effectively paying part of that price for their freedom and I think it’s well worth it. Just like, you know, and you know, if our country for us to have freedoms we, you know, the prices that the military has paid for our freedoms was well worth it and amazing and I think right now we’re going through something similar on a different type of scenario, but yet similar when it comes to the pro abortion people or, you know, attacking the pro-life group. And so I think that price that we’re paying is well worth it and in the end, I don’t think we should, you know, we’re not going to give up, we’re not going to surrender. You know, in the end, we believe wholeheartedly that God will come out as the champion of this, of this, of this war. And so we’re, we’re going to keep, you know, plugging away, keep working, keep praying, keep being kind and having love and joy for people even in the midst of the spiritual war, this real war, this except, you know, even in the midst of the battle. And so I think, yeah, I just encourage people to, Yeah, to know that god’s going to win and that we’re not, You know, we’re just going to keep going regardless of the opposition wanting us to stop, regardless of the opposition wanting us to, you know, to shift our passion into a different territory or space. This seems to be one of their tactics to say, I wish you could just be as passionate here as you are for the unborn, but the unborn are the ones currently, you know, going through a Holocaust type of experience and we’re not out of the woods we’re not out of the woods yet and so we need to keep and they need a voice they need someone to stand up for them.

Maria Gallagher :

Yeah, we’re not going to be intimidated we’re not going to back down. We’re going to continue to fight for the lives of those precious preborn babies and their mothers. And it’s very important to recognize the fact that there have been more than 63000000 abortions in this country since 1973 in the Roe versus Wade decision, 63000000 it. It’s a difficult number to think about and just in Pennsylvania alone each year more than 32,000 thousand abortions occur so that’s how many kindergarten classes that aren’t there because of abortion. It’s just mind boggling. And a lot of people to this day don’t realize how widespread abortion is they don’t recognize those numbers. And it’s important for us to get the word out, to get the truth out, that there are so many people who are suffering because of abortion there are those precious babies, their mothers and their fathers, and we need to fight for the rights of those people and the unborn children cannot speak up for themselves that’s why we have to speak up for them. And it’s incumbent upon all of us to do what we can, in any way we can to restore that culture of life in our country. Because our country is going to be better off because of it. Our country will be better off with the demise of Roe versus Wade. Our country would be much better off without legal abortion.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah so Speaking of so with abortion becoming illegal in 26 states, what is what does that look like for the abortion pill or the second pill out of the abortion pill regiment being shipped through the US mail to someone that lives in one of those states? Because I don’t believe there’s any kind of filter for the post office or the mail coming in that could detect an illegal abortion pill coming through the mail. And then again, I guess I don’t you know that I think about it there could be you know, illegal drugs being shipped to the mail regularly and I don’t know how anyone would detect those but when it comes to the abortion pill being shipped from Europe or from, you know, from a, you know, from overseas to, you know, bypassing the FDA, bypassing the state legislation, bypassing you know any kind of, I don’t know what kind of check there is, but what’s I guess what does that scenario look like in this post row world?

Maria Gallagher :

We really need to educate women about the dangers of the abortion pill. That there have been women who have actually died as a result of the abortion pill and there have been women who have suffered tremendously hemorrhaging as a result of the abortion pill. And a lot of women may not know that the abortion pill can actually be reversed, that there is such a thing as abortion pill reversal and there’s an abortion pill reversal network of doctors who stand ready to assist a woman if she’s taken the first abortion pill and she changes her mind. There is a chance that she can reverse the abortion process through additional medication which those pro-life OBGY NS can provide to her. So I think that this is the new frontier of education in the pro-life movement, getting women to realize the dangers of those chemical abortions and getting women to realize that the chemical abortions can be reversed in some cases. And it’s no secret that the abortion industry is turning toward chemical abortions more and more. I know in Pennsylvania chemical abortions are skyrocketing in our Commonwealth and this is true across the nation. And it’s very interesting that the abortion is switching localities from the abortion center to a woman’s home and think of how traumatic that can be for a woman i mean every time she steps into her home, she could be reminded of that abortion. And I think that it’s important for us to reach out to those women as never before and educate them about the dangers of the chemical abortions and to examine what legal remedies there may be at either the state or the federal level to try to address what is going to be a crisis in this country.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah i think, I think that’s spot on because if someone takes the abortion pill regiment and it doesn’t work let’s say they bought it and they take it at the wrong time, you know meaning that they’re further in their pregnancy and it and it doesn’t have the abortion result. And if by chance that woman also happened to have an ectopic pregnancy which I believe happens about 3 % of the time. The symptoms of an ectopic pregnancy might be very similar to that of the medical the medication abortion pill. And if she doesn’t get medical assistance and find out that there’s an ectopic pregnancy, we could, you know, she would end up having serious medical problems. And I think those are going to turn out to be horror stories and really in the end when a woman is experiencing pregnancy she needs medical. You know, an ultrasound can be life saving. Medical help can be life saving and if women are trying to take care of this abortion on their own in their bathroom solo without anyone helping them, especially medical personnel and an ultrasound, there’s a there’s a high chance that you know that there can be terrible results out of this. And then yeah and when it comes to things being shipped to the mail there’s no guarantee as to whether or not the right dosage or the appropriate amounts are being applied to someone in a certain scenario or if someone’s buying it for somebody else there’s all sorts of bad a bad things that could take place there and it just seems like as an overall, I think, you know it feels like there’s a group of people. There’s people who have treated abortion as a way of they’re treating like birth control more so than what it really is, which is ending the life of a of a of a individual with unique DNA. And they’re essentially trying to, yeah, for a variety of reasons of, you know, a large number of reasons that are, you know, that’s none of those reasons outweigh ending someone else’s life, as you know, because life is so precious and amazing. But yeah, there’s. Yeah, it’s just very. It’s just. But all that to say is that, yeah, it’s very dangerous and there’s going to be some really bad stories that come out of it. And but yet, you know, these medication abortions are still being promoted almost as if they want to have a reason for legislation to say we need to legalize it because we’re going to make these bad situations take place. But obviously these are bad things you know, we should not be. You know, having these drugs shipped from certain places overseas is a really bad thing and maybe the FDA needs to figure out how to stop these sources of the abortion pill or the second pill out of the abortion pill regiment from being shipped, or both pills being shipped to ship shipped to the USA we need to crack down on these sources of essentially illegal drugs that are being shipped in and bypassing the FDA and bypassing local legislation, bypassing the Women’s Health and creating problems for our communities.

Maria Gallagher :

Definitely and I think that it’s also important to keep in mind just how many times women are pressured into having abortions by their boyfriends, husbands, even parents or grandparents. And those individuals may be ordering the abortion pills and forcing them down the woman’s throat. And so that’s a terrible tragedy that may be happening, and we need to protect women as much as possible from that, whatever regulatory measures can be taken. Because this whole idea that it’s a woman’s free choice, in many cases it is not. She’s making the choice that another person wants for her, and she feels as if she has no choice, and she may be threatened with eviction if she doesn’t abort she may be threatened with losing her job or losing her relationship, all sorts of things. And it’s incumbent upon us to reach out to these pregnant women with compassion and love and to tell them there is a better way.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah, it seems like the number one cause of abortion is typically how another person responds and influences the woman in this time. And it’s also true that the number one cause for life or for a woman to embrace life, I think is also very often another person who might say, you know, who’s there to support and listen and provide care and bolster her in having maybe, you know, whether it’s a parent, you know, whether it’s parenting or adoption. And so I think very often when a woman is in that, in that position of she’s at risk of choosing abortion or she, you know, whether it’s a small amount of risk or a large amount of risk of leaning towards that direction. It seems like another person, whether it’s the boyfriend or the husband or a friend or a or a spouse or it could be a parent or just a neighbor or someone at church or someone at work that, you know what other people do to speak into her life has a huge impact. And I think that’s partly why Pansy clinics are so impactful at helping women choose life is because they, you know, they provide care and listening and they build rapport and they speak truth into her life and along with resources. And I think if more people did that would that would be the wave to bring women into choosing parenting and adoption more often would be other people providing that support and care. But at the same time, other people can also speak death into her life like if she goes to a Planned Parenthood, 90 % of women will choose abortion but if she goes to a pricey clinic, 80 some % of women will choose life even if they were abortion minded going in. And so another person, that voice, that the voice that she hears has a huge impact on whether or not she thinks she can do it, whether or not she gets the support or not to make it, you know, for what, for the, for what that decision is that she ends up making her support. Yeah the support that goes into being a parent is very impactful to people in this at risk zone of going one way or the other.

Maria Gallagher :

Oh, definitely and there was a study that was done of women who had abortions and who then regretted them. And it found something like 85 % of those women would have chosen life for their children if just one person had been willing to support them just one person, and that one person can be any one of us.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah, there was a study. Well, someone was saying if they could do a study on. You know, women having an abortion or not having abortion and then trying to find out, you know it, how those unwanted babies would end up becoming criminals or not. And what’s interesting is that there are several people who have survived abortion and I think their stories really ring true as to how much how they value their life and how they are, how they cherish life and how they have life and I don’t think that’s it you know, there’s no right for any of us to say to someone because you have a high chance of becoming a criminal that you shouldn’t have breath, you shouldn’t have a birthday, you shouldn’t have a childhood or the chance at life. I think, you know everyone should have a chance regardless of the chances of them making good or bad decisions down the road because all of us make a variety of decisions and we all need care and healing and help and Jesus and God and support and so and really in the end, yeah so all I have to say is i think when it comes to someone saying that you know that this person should have an abortion because we’re going to have a terrible life, that’s it that’s not a good reason to kill somebody that’s not a good reason to not let them have life not to have a their initial birthday, not to have a chance at life and yeah, so I’ll have to say it, I just I don’t think there’s any good arguments for abortion but there are lots of arguments for abortion, at least there’s a lot of quantity of abortion arguments. But in reality none of them are. You know, the morality of them or the ethical level of them are all terrible like they’re just they’re just simply full of death and excuses. But really in the end everyone needs a, you know, it’s wonderful to have life and then but yeah, everyone will do. Everyone will need help and healing and guidance and love and care like that’s part of who everyone is. And so just to say someone’s likely to be unwanted and more likely to go to jail is no reason to not give them a chance at breath and to have their birthday. And then also yeah, but there is a need to provide care to everybody and you know, so there is there’s a, there’s a, there’s a need for providing love and care to people. And I think that’s where the church is and that’s where loving people have the opportunity to do more, is to love on people who are unwanted. I think it was Mother Teresa said send me, send me all of them like, I think she said something like send me all of the unwanted children like that was my that’s my paraphrase version of what she said but yeah, send them all to me and I’ll i’ll take them all. And so I think that I think that’s really, you know, that could be a universal position for all of us who see, you know, who are trying to, who have the love of Jesus in US and we’re looking to love others is to say send them to me i will help them send them, yeah don’t kill them send them to me. We’ll take them. We’ll help them. I think that could be a universal posture for all of us.

Maria Gallagher :

Yes and I think that if you notice the experience of women who go to pregnancy resource centers, they’re more likely to get prenatal care they’re more likely to get immunizations for their children. Once the children are born, they’re more likely to be upstanding citizens and good mothers. And we shouldn’t make a judgment that just because a woman is in challenging circumstances, that woman is not going to be a good mother, You know, with support and with understanding and with compassion, She can be a good mother and she can take care of her children. She can hold down a job, and she can be a vital force for good in the world. And it’s only those people who want to sell abortion that sell women short.

Jacob Barr :

Yeah, and the abortion industry does have a they make a profit off of this they get large amounts of funding based on, with the goal of abortions and the pro-life world we work so hard to raise money in order to then provide free and confidential medical services to women. You know, we’re essentially providing, yeah, medical raised services with nurses and doctors and medical equipment with you know, who are trained and provide a high level of service. And we and most groups provide that at no cost to the woman who needs those services. And so essentially, yeah, we’re fundraising really hard and we’re doing a lot of fundraising work in order to provide free services to as many women as you know who may who may let us provide those services to them. And so I think Prancy clinics are, you know, providing this passionate hard working care and it’s just amazing that you know medical grade services for free it’s just amazing what they do. Prancy clinics are amazing and thank goodness for the pro-life communities who help support these Prancy clinics who are providing these medical care because without the supporters provide, you know, because there’s a lot of costs that go into medical care. And so this is definitely not free, but it’s being made, it’s made, made available to free for the to the clients who are, you know, who can take advantage of these services in order to receive the support and care and services that they’re looking for and they what they really need in their situation.

Maria Gallagher :

Absolutely and the pro-life movement is proud to work arm in arm, hand in hand with the pregnancy center movement all across the country. And these centers empower women to make life affirming choices for themselves and their families. It’s a it’s a truly inspiring labor of love that these pregnancy centers provide. And I’ve seen it first hand and it brings joy to my heart to see all the women who were helped by these pregnancy centers and will be helped in the future.

Jacob Barr :

Awesome well, Marie, I really appreciate your time and just your thoughts and input on all this. And would you, as we wrap up this podcast, will you just, you know, sort of wrap this up with a prayer, A prayer for what God leads you to pray for?

Maria Gallagher :

I would be happy to. Here is Heavenly Father we thank you so much for the blessing of our time together. We ask for abundant blessings upon all those who are listening to this podcast. We ask you to extend your loving arms around all those pregnant women who are seeking help at this very moment. Please steer them in the direction of those pregnancy centers that can provide that compassionate support. Please give strength and courage and hope to those who volunteer and work at those centers so that they can in turn minister to the many women who need their help. And we ask for an overturn of Roe versus Wade, and we ask for an end to legal abortion, and we ask for a renewal of our culture so that we will indeed support life. We ask all of this through Christ our lord amen.

Jacob Barr :

Amen. Well, thank you, Maria it’s been a pleasure to talk with you and I just really appreciate what you’re doing as this pro-life world. Just like the body of Christ there’s a lot of different parts of the pro-life world and it’s wonderful to have different people working in different ways that, but all towards the same goal and mission.

Maria Gallagher :

It’s been a pleasure to be with you today thank you very much.